A Prophetic Teacher once said, "If you dont go away from this with something of worth which you want to outwork into your life, or you hear what i am saying and there is no beneficial life application - Its Not Teaching". GAZ.DRUM@NTLWORLD.COM - LETS TALK This blog is dedicated to truths or views which lend themselves to LIFE APPLICATION when the walls of church are no longer there to '''KEEP US SAFE AND SEPARATE TILL HEAVEN'''.

Wednesday, June 29, 2005

FORERUNNERS + SCOUTS + BARDS

Just some stuff that is around at present which i thought i would download in light of comments which have been exhilarating.
Some of the comments are around grace / need of the spirit / hearing God and running / running as many hear but do not run.

When i began this present journey of coming out of congregational leadership and going to ground, i wanted to ensure that i wasnt adding to dysfunction, creating something i or another generation woudl be repenting for, so really had to check my spirit - and seek counsel.
So i shared my heart with a few seasoned folks and this came back:
"What your talkign about seems to be what prophetic folks and others are hearing. The trouble is, very few are responding to what they are hearing but have become observers of others, waitng for something to happen or afraid to risk. Its important that someone seeks to establish what they are seeing in this new landscape, there will come a time when the churhc as a whole will ask such questions and they need to be able to see ' a parable in the land'.

I think there is an element of scouts, in that some are certainly hearing this stuff ahead of others - and have a duty to God to come in line with what they are hearing (if one know what he must do but does not do it - then for him this is sin). In part they are forerunners, They Are Not Experimenting, int he sense that they have gone to a new land as day trippers, They Have Cut The Bungee And Jumped, They Have Burned Their Bridges In Conviction To Go Into The New - There Is No Old To Return To If It Doesnt Work Out.
But We Need Relationship To The Old Skins (as ive said before - we arent told to shove old wine in new skins - so the old has a use for the old in one respect - both skins - both are wine((( having said that - i dont think the existing contexts of church should have EVER occurred and at one level are just simply unbiblical - extrabibilical - scripture through constantionian eyes)) ...)
Great to run with the new - someone needs to - it needs relationship to the rest of the body in a scouting way to say HEY GOD WAS HERE ALL THE TIME - HE IS IN US AND THROUGH ALL THINGS so COME - "what? Is It Safe? Heck NO ITS NOT SAFE - BUT ITS GOOD" (aslan)

Sorry - waffling a bit - need my first coffee of the day and some shreddies (wheaty bites).

So what am i saying....... You can observe Developments, to see if its safe, but A) your in deep trouble if you were asked to run but your just watching / observing and as some i have met....being 'commentators on something that at one level needs objectivity but to really BE THE CHURCH as Christ intended - Is Utterly Subjective...so you 'CANT' watch.
B) .............. What the heck is B? dunno - fill the space yourself.

Oh - I did say Bards................ We need to know where we have come from, we need to take responsibility for where we have been - every mistake has a face - heaven weeps over lost saints etc........... to ever be able to Go where we need to Go and not just repeat it all over again.
Bards - Oral Tradition........................... we need people to tell us who we are? i think many of us have fogotten. I think when we see ourselves and out various contexts within the fulness of history - the diversity of the saints - how the FRINGE always seems to become the mainstream.... i think we will be less judging . more gracious. more willing to do more that Adjust and Try Experiments with limited risk - and limited outcome.
Thank you Wesley that when you were outcast - you preached from your fathers grave.
Thank You Evan Roberts for working with teams of Women to reach the hearts of Broken men
Thank You Elijah for your honesty, willingness to be weak even in the shadow of breakthrough, to work with a generation - and when it was time - to pass on your mantel.
Thank you old ladies in the Hebridies - Who just prayed and saw 75% of that revival come to Christ - not having known his name - not having entered a church - but through the conviction of the Spririt.
Thank You Father that You Have No Box - Except The Limitation Of Our Minds And Fears.

Some of us need to Die For Christs Gain all over again. Some of us are eating off a Pizza Hut Plate - Where Weve Eaten Some Juicy Bits - The Crust Is Adding Up And There Is No Space For Fresh Bits.... When All We Need To Do Is Ask For Another Plate.


Why is it when someone 'often' says ' Here Guys - Here's a blank sheet of paper - how would you do it differently - we think its just a game - and dont think we can do that - or at least work towards that?

Ok - Im off my horse now in this comment............ If we are unable to steer a big ship of histories construction, which some darned fool said - here, your steering this now - and for the rest of your life (as you dream of retirement or a second call). We need to be willing to let people use the life boats...whatever those life boats 'are' for them........ let them discover some islands in search of life and peoples. Let us help them cast off, untie the rope and wish them well. IF we cannot walk differently or fully ourselves - lets at least help some folks to do so - so that they might become those parables to the rest of us - lets bless them with as much provision as their little boats will carry. And if they screw up? we can either send more boats or say - SEE, I TOLD YOU IT WASNT SAFE and it wasnt good - come back to the new temple where God is? (or at least feels obliged to visit between the hours of 10 and 12 on a sunday)


Dang It - being aware of old lenses in our glasses - i need to point out that for some reading this - i have just re enforced the centre - by making them think we are meant to have a ship. Heck - scuttle the ship - get everyone to the lifeboats. Follow the fella walking on the water.

I like this qoute
"Lets fish - but stuff whos boat is who's - just get them to the shore"
G Man

5 Comments:

Blogger Shepherd Michael said...

Who says that we are even to have lifeboats? Maybe the call is to step out on the water like Peter did.

While this sounds noble, I confess that there's a part of me that has a stronghold of wanting to have a pair of water-wings stashed away under "Plan B". My ironic sense of humor conjures up new meanings for "as deep calls to deep".
Lord have mercy on me.

Gaz, I rejoice that the previous dialog got the juices flowing. As with the other posts, this one (and the subsequent chat) has given me a lot to chew on.
Excelsior!
Shepherd Michael

11:29 pm

 
Blogger al bino said...

All Gravy as they say southside (all good)
The boat imagery for me is one of congregational organisations, which by nature have hierachical leadership (even if theyve tried to squash it down to make it flat), thus we can take the imagery for pyramids. In seeking to see multiple pyramids work together in a town - if we shove them side by side (as its generally the congregational leaders who try to do the unity thing on our behalf) then what you get is pyramids toucking one another at their lowest point of reference, the lowest corners. Much of what they are is unable to come together.
In 1 of my earlier posting i talked about 'the church of here of the church of elsewhere'. In this i was pointing out that often, the people who are the church, in and through all things, are unable to stand there effectively AS the church, with other saints from other pyramids - because church has a time and place and container somewhere else. As such - they are there, they may set up yet another 'support and survive' group, but ultimately cannot stand fully as church as the fragmentation embodied on sunday mornigns across the town exists within those groupings at work. Church of elsewhere, time place spiritual special things but not elsewhere in any significant way. Some have though ive been saying scrap sundays, now were planting congregation in the work place and thats where its at.......... No No No No No.... not at all. I am though calling for the De Centralisation of the organisation we call church. Nearly all people IN the church get up and GO to church are par OF the church of this or that name. Totally unscriptural in terms of the body in a locality. So when i say scuttle the ship - im saying, de centralise. I dont want us to find another engine for the titanic - however many times i watch the movie and will the end ot be different - the titanic sinks. I fell there is an innevitability that is at work here.
You can meet on sunday - be radical ad meet on thursday instead - but if we measure our folks through their proximity to that meeting - we have a centre - we also have a fringe - we have in and we have out. Also - what the heck is 'seeker friendly'? a Pleasure boat? When we GATHER as the body - it is Christian people doing business with God. Ok - so it says not to do the tongues thing without interpretation if some poor old soul walks in off the street. But it is a business meeting of the body. There IS defenately and In and an OUT to that. But because Church and Family is in and through every minute of every day - there is far less of that mentality. Relationships are relationships - i am church standing in the world , now i beleive 'one' in christ is a majority - that encouraging - but i belive there was a mandate in 'two or more' then Im in the mix - church is happening - kingdom is advancing - strongholds of heaven are being established where your feet tread.
Its vital though that we realise this part, as many saints do not. '''' Where Two Or More Are Gathered IN MY NAME, then were having a jesus party. I think peopel forget to be togetehr in a place of life and work and for it to fully be In His Name and for his purposes to perform. If were hanging out somewhere, a couple of christians without that understanding and application, i dont think we get the church label really - do we? Is church a description of Christs people who are In The Heaven Club - or people who are the living daily embodiment of Christ on earth - who got out of the way so the mulitplied spirit might make us multiple christs to the ends of the earth.

Life boats - - - is really trying to find some of those absent colours in the rainbow of life called church. If the boat is still happy to plough in in pyramid 'cant connect' fully AS the body in a place.... stuff it, find another way to live - cause thats just black and white - i dont even think those colours are in the rainbow are they?

What Vehicle of Connectivity and Christ in The Mix do we have - where is it counterproductive and counter life and counter christian?
Cause its probably already sinking and needs to sink.
MORE DIVERSITY but MORE UNITY

Im not sure how much more we cant do surgery on metaphors but its worth a go.
g

8:21 am

 
Blogger Shepherd Michael said...

diane said
"that's cos we find it hard to look outside the box, but sometimes not just that but to explain something that has no shape. with where i'm at there has been alot of talk about being connected to people, and really that is where it is, and like you say that can be anywhere. there is nothing wrong with cathedral or coffee shop so long as people are connecting with each other, connecting with the world around and bringing Jesus into it!!!
but let's stop trying to explain soemthing that is unexplainable!!"

Sister Diane, well said!
I do believe that it has to be dynamic in that it will look different for each "realm" in the Kingdom. I believe there are some "core" values/dynamics that will be the same for all. A good read on this is "Releasing the Gospel from Western Bondage" by Jonathan Campbell.

6:11 pm

 
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