A New One On ME........... lets work it out
Ok - thought i would try something new. Usually i am prone to making heartfelt statement, usually because im shouting at the silence where i see deficits. On this occassion, i really just want to chat - if anyone is listening.
In the uk, the church is in terminal decline, we are at approx 10% and dropping, some amercian futurists now say we are in terminal decline, past the point of no natural return without a total change or/and an inbreaking of God.
The question i ask (and mostly it relates to the saint being in a through all things), is this:
We are one in ten Right? What is going to result in that one in ten having a radical effect, how is that likely to unfold from where it is now, what type of people do the need to be, where do they need to be, how do they need to be. If we are to have a hope.
Answers on a postcard to..................................................... comments.
Look fwd to hearing from folks.
gaz
posted by al bino at 7:13 pm
11 Comments:
Although I am not that familiar with the particular context of the UK, I still have some thoughts (hopefully, that is not presumptuous on my part). I have this sense that what we really need is an impartation of the virtue of heaven. Perhaps including a real revelation of our citizenship there. So that we are so 'in tune' with the heartbeat of heaven that we actually carry heaven's atmosphere around with us, and it's dynamics affect change wherever we go, just simply because we are carriers or conduits of the glory. What does that look like? I don't know. I know I don't have it. But I really think that we need to learn how to operate in the spirit realm, learning to function in these things - cooperation with the angelic, visitation to the third heaven, and all the other things in the Bible that we are so unfamiliar with (the Enlightenment heritage and the counterfeit in the occult have turned us away from this). If we can align with heaven, and learn to cooperate with heaven by learning to function "in the spirit" then I think that will make a huge difference in what is accomplished. (This also requires a relinquishment of our own best efforts - which really amounts to us being in control). If we look at places where Christianity is exploding and having a real impact, they are all places where the realities of the spirit realm are understood and participated in by the people as common practice. So this is just one thought.
4:54 am
Can i just apologise if my comments or even my posts have a fair bit of attitude. Im not really sorry for their town, but i do appologise if they make anyone feel under attack or personally critised. Whilst the buck stop with us, and everything is personal BECAUSE WE ARE PERSONS, my rant is at the body corporate trying to get their attention. As such - is not at all balanced which im happy with as im shouting in the place of defectit. Hope thats ok.
Sarah, thanks for your thoughts, i really value them, as with others.
I think the 'post christendom' nature of our nation here is a key issue, rather unchartered territory. It is difficult to draw strength from revival dynamics in largely 'pre' christianised dynamics which is most of them. We really do have to find a new way here. Brownsville Pensecola for instance, in my view, was largely are 'repentant return' to faith for slackers and disillusioned fringers in a yet still christian nation (generally - in terms of a national identity - Although i know it is different on the ground). I guess my fathers wartime generation is the last wave of people in Britain to think themselves Christian because of where they were born. We no longer have that to wrestle with as at least some context of identifying. Most would choose to strongly not identify today. In our geographical census which take place periodically, we even used to have most people tick the box of 'church of england', not to describe what they are, but to state that they are not something else. Thats long lost now and probably a good thing.
I wonder if i dare say - this is a post biblical situation (very happy to be corrected).
I am very pleased that there is this revival dynamic in what i would call 1st word nations - where for many they have no concept of christ. Its exciting from the point of view that it is wonderfully fragrant of biblical stories, and so it should be, signs to point the way to the wonders of Jesus.
I do have that concern that the shepherds will gather the flocks'in' all over again, and our S of church will be imperially imposed, even though at their source, most have died or played a part in the of church growth.
I worry and i watch. What does God have in store for a nation, which is not so much suffering as a result of not hearing of him, but of indifferance.
There are a lot of prayer things happening right now which are engaging in a cry of mercy, that we, do not get, what we deserve. Some feeling that some aspect of judgement is innevitable, and who's intercession have more to do with Damage Limitation at this stage, feeling something is imminently already on its way, like the judgement train has already left the station.
Personally, i dont know. Part of me is expecting a fall, before a rise. We certainly do need something at this stage of biblical proportions to gain a response of biblical credibility.
Watch and Pary - Watch and Pray.
g
12:05 pm
watch and pray - not watch and pary - sounds like fencing!
12:06 pm
Hey gaz, your really great and your going to change the world by annoying people!!
actually its gaz, just seeing if i could 'big myself up' anonymously - ha
12:07 pm
Yes, that's true (about the contexts being so different, therefore the revival dynamics do not necessarily translate across the board). And I also appreciate the comparison with the US (still Christian nation vs. post-Christian) because that does help me to understand the UK context better. You are right, although it has been hard for me at times to see America as "Christian" - but it is true. Anyway, I appreciate your musings, even the ones with edge and attitude. Maybe especially those ones. If not anything else, I am challenged to take what I do not yet understand to the Lord. Which is probably what I should have done with your question about the UK in the first place. Truth be told, I have a desire to spend time there and for God to move in your nation. I don't yet know much about all the spiritual dynamics there, but when the Lord releases me and when it is the proper time, I do pray that I can come to the UK and partner with God for the nation. Maybe it's a thing of 'the hearts of the children' turning back to the fathers. As an American, England is my parent nation...
12:43 pm
sarah - do you want to chat off site?
gaz.drum@ntlworld.com. Would value asking about what your in more specifically, perhaps better not in public.
g
3:15 pm
So interesting . . . my beautiful bride/warrior mate of 27 years (tomorrow!) and i have had a heart for Scotland~England~Ireland for years. One of our desires is to travel there to share/pray/co-labor. Maybe Papa God is calling folks from here, from all over, to travel to the lands of our ancesters . . . to where the likes of Aidan and Patrick and Columba once walked and took the Good News to all.
Just remember: Papa God is way, way bigger than any statistic of "decline". The enemy seeks to steal, kill and destroy. But Jesus is BIG, way BIG. BIG BIG GOD, itty-bitty devil.
So, to my brothers and sisters across the pond:
Do not despair. Keep Pressing On. Papa God gets the last word as to what goes down in your home town.
Phillipians 1
6 being confident of this, that He who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus.
I don't know if you all have read "Wild at Heart" and "Waking the Dead" by John Eldredge, but in one of them (I forget which one and I don't have my copies with me) John speaks of visiting Lindasfarne. Whilst reflecting upon the lifes of Aidan and the other Celtic Saints, John heard a rhema voice say
"I'm doing this again . . ." (my paraphrase)
Maybe what you all are doing is
"Maybe i'm the chance of rain"? (from "Stars" by Switchfoot)
Selah . . .
11:03 pm
Sarah, what you say about "aligning with Heaven" . . . so cool! Sounds like something Martin Scott said to us over here a few years back. Very important. You asked "But what does it look like? I don't know."
Don't feel bad, I don't think any of us has the complete picture. Maybe bits-n-pieces of it. It shall unfold as we go along, as we align with Heaven, Papa God and the flow of the Wild Goose. To what Gax posted from Larry Randolph, and to what has just been "released" by Dutch Sheets (The Shift of 2006); both of these use the word (or variation there-of) "Transition". Transitions have a way of upsetting things cause we don't have all the answers or know all the "game plan". But that's cool (and yes, sometimes scary) because we do know The One who does know the complete picture.
Oh what interesting times we live in . . .
11:15 pm
Aligning With Heaven - Conform To The Cross, very martin scott - i agree.
Someone said to me, ' we must always take fromt he past that which was for learning and that which is eternal (or did i say that) and allow our shape and form to be dictated by the coming heaven.
What i think is hugely hillarious is theres all my talk about getting out of the box and the new jerusalem is gonna decend like a cube......... HA!
I think thats a christian joke!
never been to west coast sadly. been to savanah orlando seattle and spokane to hang with folks. Two duties and delights, us as a fathering nation to make repair, yours to help us get our house back in order, not s, but family and the apostolic seed that has grown returning. Those who have sent, must learn to recieve.
9:25 am
sarah and michael, this is a good web to peruse. my friend shannon is from savannah and is a missionary here for want of a better word. She has been back and forth since the late 90's for long durations. Its a deeply intimate 'god at work and faith' type site with lots of readers. If you wanted to know what its like ont he ground here from an american perspective.
She is up in Scotland this week, having stated 'is there anyone out there 'i can love on and serve' a pastor and his wife trying to bring reforms from a place of isolation there have paid her travel up on a luxury sleeper train.
ha
www.10lampsoffire.net
9:29 am
Oh yah, I know Shannon. HooYah! What a sister! The stuff she shares brings fire to my soul and an occasional tear to my eye. I first read some of her stuff on 24/7, which led me to her web page. It's a small world . . . her links led me here; so cool!
Gaz, oi! what you say about "us as a fathering nation to make repair, yours to help us get our house back in order" . . . this is so rock-solid! Reminds me of Malachi 4:6 "Turn the hearts of the fathers to their children and the heart of the children to their fathers" in many ways. America does owe a lot, spiritual heritage-wise, to the U.K.
This April, in the Los Angeles area, they are preparing to commemorate the Azusa revival, which many of us believe was just a continuation of what the Holy Spirit started in Wales in 1904 (Azusa "happened" in 1906).
6:32 pm
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